Four towers in Bricktown? Did mafia ties doom OKC shopping center? Your questions answered

The Oklahoman’s Steve Lackmeyer fielded reader questions Friday during his weekly OKC Central Live Chat. You can join Steve most Fridays at 10 a.m. to add your comments and questions about downtown development.

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Below is an edited transcript of Friday’s discussion:

Developer committed to starting multi-tower construction later this year

Q: What’s the status of the Dream hotel development? Is it viable? Lots of things get dreamed up but never have a chance. Are the developers serious? 

A: Just talked with developer Scott Matteson and he’s quite serious. The Boardwalk at Bricktown expanded this past year to span four towers, all between 24 and 26 stories, with three to be housing and one to be a 315-room Dream Hotel. The residential towers will bring 1,000 units to Bricktown if built. Matteson said that in addition to the towers, a handful of free-standing restaurants will be built around a lagoon in the heart of the development.

The Oklahoma City Council on Tuesday approved carving out a new, 25-year tax increment financing district for the property, which is located on surface parking between the BNSF railway viaduct, Reno Avenue and the U-Haul warehouse. Matteson is anticipating the application from the new TIF district will total $220 million for the $600 million development.

Matteson said we should see drawings come out for design review later this spring and that construction will start either in the third or fourth quarter of this year.

I asked Matteson about the rising construction costs and interest rates that have proven challenging for a lot of developments both locally and nationwide.

“We feel confident financing will be in place,” Matteson said. “Our costs have come down over the last year with redesign. We were very conservative at the start and we’ve worked with our contractor on doing value engineering to keep the costs down.”

Both Matteson and Lower Bricktown developer Randy Hogan are aware that hearts have been broken in the past when a similar sized development, OGE Energy Center, got everyone excited and then it collapsed. They say this is real deal, a development that is going to happen and will happen soon.

No zombie towers in OKC, but what else lurks in the dark shadows of the office market?

New ownership coming soon for former downtown Holiday Inn?

Q: Back in 2018, Jonathan Russell purchased the old Holiday Inn located at 520 W Main for just over $6 million. There were talks for TIF, but with the OMNI not allowing hotel TIF deals, it was expected it would be apartments. It went up for sale again in 2021 and still hasn't changed hands. Any idea when we can see something happen here?

A: Jonathan Russell reports the property is under contract and will likely close this summer.

First tenants to lease at Broadway Park include a restaurant and bar

Q: It looks like Allison Bailey handled the transaction to sell the land to the east of Angry Scotsman Brewery on Reno. The buyer is Downtown Real Estate Partners. Looking at the Oklahoma ROD, the primary on that is Tyler Muzny. Any idea what the plan is here? The property is just under an acre. 

A: She's not talking. I'll do some digging.

She did report that we're finally seeing leasing with the Broadway Park building at NW 11 and Broadway with a restaurant and bar signed up for the ground floor and an office user for the fifth floor.

Who is better? Local or out-of-state developers?

Q: Steve: In your opinion, when it comes to commercial real estate development, is Oklahoma City better off with out-of-state developers with deep pockets and bigger scale developments (like you might see in Dallas or Houston).....or developments by local developers with more limited resources and smaller scale? 

A: I think we're best off when we get a balanced mix of both. I think First National had to have a local like Gary Brooks to help lead it to a successful redevelopment as a hotel, housing and retail. But he also had a Texas developer, the late Charlie Nicholas, as a partner who was just as critical to making this win possible.

OKC dodges 'zombie office towers' so far , but has dealt with dead-eyed vacant buildings before

Which controversial past decision was the right choice?

Q: What is something that still gets complained about that happened a long time ago and you think is still valid? Demolition of Stage Center? Biltmore? Buildings on SW 4 and Robinson torn down to make way for the Scissortail Park? Other? 

A: The 26-story Biltmore Hotel demolition had to happen. The building was built at a time when we were switching to window air conditioning units, so the floor to ceiling span wasn't what it was when the Skirvin was built to include tall enough spans to allow for outside air flow.

If we didn't tear down the Biltmore Hotel, it would have stayed empty and falling into disrepair for years if not decades. The focus would have been on finding a way to rescue it at the cost of not doing anything with the Skirvin. The Biltmore would have competed for the resources that were needed to bring the Skirvin back to life.

Stage Center should have been a part of MAPS 4. It was torn down for a development that in retrospect was shaky at best. I still think the city made a mistake tearing down the Film Exchange building on the east fringe of the park. It could have been a cool preservation.

Replacing late arts advocate Robbie Kienzle not easy

Q: With the passing of Robbie Kienzle, what is the next downtown art installation we should be excited about? Who is picking up that torch? 

A: I don't know that we can ever replace someone like Robbie. She brought so much experience, know-how, passion and connections to the job of being the city's art liaison. Count me among those still mourning her way-too-early passing. She left a good crew to carry on her mission and the arts commission is filled with great people who share her passion.

"Light as a Feather" at Scissortail Park is her final triumph, and quite rightly was dedicated to her memory. We will see more opportunities for great public art, but I can't say at the moment that there is anything that currently comes close to "Light as a Feather."

Dowell selling downtown tower - "temporarily"

Q: I was looking through loopnet and saw the Dowell building on Robinson was for sale (By Dowell, himself) but no price listed. Do you think he is actually interested in selling it or just putting it out there? 

A: Rick Dowell has been working on the one-time home of Kerr McGee for the past 15 years. He says asbestos removal (done with extensive city assistance) and gutting of the floors is done and the building is ready for development.

His response is he has it “for sale, temporarily.” He is no longer convinced restoration as office space is the best bet due to the hits sustained by office markets nationwide due to the pandemic and people working from home.

“If it doesn’t sell, I think as office space it’s not worth developing,” Dowell said. “I was in the apartment business and I don’t want to get into it again.”

Dowell said he had interest from several potential buyers before interest rates climbed up from 3% to 8%.

“If we hadn’t been in the situation with the interest rates, there were a lot of people willing to pay $15 million to $20 million for it,” Dowell said. “If we don’t get someone to buy the building in the next couple of months, we’re going to convert the lobby, concourse and second floor into offices. We have a permit already at the city.”

With that work done, Dowell said, he anticipates cash flow will make the building more attractive for sale to an apartment developer to convert the remainder of the 20-story tower into housing. Dowell said discussions are ongoing with an office user and a developer who remains interested in converting the building into housing.

Related: Could Oklahoma City's Lower Bricktown soon see four new high-rise towers?

Is OKANA resort being built too far away from Riversport and boathouse district?

Q: Is the OKANA resort by the First Americans Museum in a good location what with Riversport a mile away? 

A: Yes. What you're not seeing is how the resort will tie in with a pedestrian bridge that will likely double as a regatta viewing area over the river and will link in to the north shore where trails will connect to the boathouses and Riversport. What we are seeing is the emergence of river anchors on both shores - OKANA, Riversport, the boathouses, Wheeler, and more to come. Infill is increasingly likely as all of this progresses with the trails serving as the needed connector.

Odds low for streetcar expansion

Do you think that the expansion of bus rapid transit to northeast OKC and Capitol Hill will limit future growth of the street car? 

A: I suspect it is the failed design of the streetcar that will limit any future growth. Kansas City showed us, as we were designing our system, how linear dual tracks are the best approach to using streetcars as public transit. But our city fell for the urging of an out-of-state consultant to instead create the equivalent of an amusement park ride downtown. It would be great to see chunks of our system turned into dual tracks. But I don't know if the political will to spend more money to fix this past decision will exist to make it happen.

Early mafia ties, neglect led demise of shopping center

Q: I see OAK rising, Mayfair in revival, and other shopping centers humming along. So, tell us about Will Rogers Park Plaza at NW 30th and Portland. Why has it been passed over? Why wouldn't a developer want to rebuild it as a mixed-use property? What's holding it back? 

A: Oh wow. I know that shopping center quite well.

I wasn't a public-school kid. My parents chose to enroll me in a private Christian school at the family's church when we moved here in the late 1970s. The church ended up in a division that led to the pastor and at least half of the congregation starting up a new church that relocated to one of the large free-standing buildings at Will Rogers Park Plaza.

The shopping center was only a few years old, but it was desolate with only a handful of tenants, including a skating rink, still open when the school and church opened at the shopping center.

What happened?

The shopping center was never welcomed by neighbors who unsuccessfully fought the development at City Hall. Dean Morgensen, a former lumberman, bought the former 30-acre riding stables for $200,000.

His inspiration for the rustic style retail plaza was the “Old Towne” complex in Dallas. He was doing something different, a shopping center that might complement the nearby Will Rogers Park. His first setback was with one of his original tenants, LeMans Amusement Center. A similar arcade was opened at Crossroads Mall in south Oklahoma City and it wasn’t long before the owner, Jay Serano, drew interest from the FBI.

Serano built the Caesar’s Palace and Circus Circus casinos using money from the Teamsters Pension fund head Allen Dorfman, who worked under Jimmy Hoffa. We know that Hoffa disappeared and was likely murdered. Dorfman also was murdered. The feds suspected Serano used the arcades to launder mob money. The scandal wasn’t the sort of publicity that helped a shopping center designed to attract an upscale customer base.

Morgensen filed a $500,000 lawsuit against the Las Vegas gambler, charging the arcade was a public nuisance and had hurt the shopping center’s reputation. Serano, who was represented by Oscar Goldman (the same guy who followed up his career as a mob attorney to become mayor of Las Vegas), closed the arcades and the lawsuit didn’t make it to trial.

Just two years after opening the shopping center, tenants were beginning to empty out of the shopping center despite Morgensen’s efforts to program it with crafts festivals. A group of teens repeatedly vandalized the shopping center, painting graffiti on the redwood siding of the buildings, destroyed the glass globe lights, broken windows, uprooted shrubs and destroyed sprinkler pipes.

A fire destroyed a jewelry store and damaged three vacant buildings at the shopping center in 1977 and the exodus of tenants grew worse. Morgensen reported the value of the shopping center had dropped by $1 million. His mortgage was foreclosed on in 1978 and the shopping center was then purchased by Charles Shadid. He then developed the remainder of the former horse stable land, but this time he went with inexpensive tilt-up concrete construction with none of the aspirations set by Morgensen.

The skating rink closed soon after the school opened, though I do remember the school hosting at least one skating session. The skating rink turned into a nightclub and the shopping center continued to go downhill. It wasn't a dangerous place. Just quiet. Forgotten. The design of the original shopping center was a misfire.

Charles Shadid, a man not known for updating his properties, owned it from 1979 until selling it last year.

I agree with you - a developer could do well clearing it all while keeping some of the larger trees and rebuilding it with housing while maybe keeping the front buildings for retail.

Is homelessness really dropping in Oklahoma City?

Q: When Mayor Holt was on the chat earlier this month, he addressed the homeless situation. He reported that homeless in Oklahoma City is actually DOWN from previous years. My response to him was that nobody believes him when he says that. My question to you, Steve: Do you believe that homeless is actually better now than it was years ago?

A: The annual homeless count indicates the number is down. But this issue is a lot more nuanced. We've seen a lot of old warehouses where the chronically homeless once sheltered redeveloped or torn down in recent years. I can't say this is the reason we're seeing more tent encampments, but I suspect there may be at least a connection that leads us to seeing what we are seeing.

I've spent the last year working with Brianna Bailey at The Frontier and Nathan Poppe at Curbside Chronicle documenting how we are losing our affordable housing inventory with a rising need for assistance. I do believe the severity of the demand is on the rise even if the numbers are down. Define "better" for me. I agree with the mayor about the numbers being down - he is providing a solid source with the homeless count. But is the situation better? I don't think so.

Former Baptist headquarters building set for renovation

Q: Back in 2019, you wrote an article about the Stryker building being sold to Richard McKown looking to do apartments and potentially redevelop the lot across the street. In january, the building was sold to Cliff Hudson. Any idea what the plan is here? 

A: Stuart and Hannah Hudson, and Stuart Hudson's father Cliff bought the building at 1141 N Robinson Ave. late last year. They are now working with preservationist/developer Marva Ellard to restore what historically was the former Baptist Convention building as a mix of offices and retail.

This article originally appeared on Oklahoman: Developer: Bricktown multi-tower construction to start later this year