Ukrainian Nobel Peace Prize winner on living through war and holding Putin accountable

Oleksandra Matviichuk, a Ukrainian human rights activist set to receive the Nobel Peace Prize in Oslo next week, joins Yahoo News Chief Investigative Correspondent Michael Isikoff to discuss her work with the Kyiv-based Center for Civil Liberties. Matviichuck explains why she believes world leaders must create a special international tribunal to place Russian President Vladimir Putin and large numbers of his military on trial for war crimes.

Video Transcript

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: All right, we are here with Oleksandra Matviichuk, a lawyer and human rights activist and director of the Center for Civil Liberties, whose organization has just won the Nobel Peace Prize. Oleksandra, Thanks for joining us.

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: Nice to meet you.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: One message you have is that Ukraine needs more weapons. Some might say it's a bit odd for a Nobel Peace Prize winner to be talking about trying to obtain more weapons of war. That does seem a contradiction on its face.

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: I can understand those people. It's a really weird situation. And I'm angry that I am in a situation when I have no legal instrument to stop Russian atrocities. It's not OK that human rights lawyer say that only weapons can save the life of people in occupied territories.

It's a very dangerous world to live in. But for current moment, it's true. We need military support in order to save livse of Ukrainians defenders and to save lives of people in the occupied territories.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: How do you respond to those who say, for the good of the Ukrainian people, there has to be some diplomatic back channel that is pursued here in hopes of reaching some sort of settlement?

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: Let's turn from the theoretical discussion to some practical examples. I have a friend, Andriana Sousak. She's a courageous woman. She stopped her commercial career in 2014 and joined Ukrainian armed forces when the war started. When the large scale invasion, started she left her six-year-old son and continued to fight for his peaceful future. And she was among those Ukrainian defenders who liberated people in Kharkiv region. She took part in the battle for Kherson.

And she was in Washington. She spoke with congressmen, with American people. And she informed about Russian atrocities and needs of Ukrainian army in order to stop them. And she asked for armored vehicles. Because she witnessed a lot of accidents when military-- Ukrainian militaries use civilian cars because they have no armored vehicles. And they were exploded on mines.

And several days ago, her car was exploded [INAUDIBLE]. It's not a theoretical discussion. It's a real discussion. So it's an illusion to think that Putin will stop if he obtains something. Putin will stop only when he will be stopped. And this means that we have to oppose and to resist to Putin jointly. Because if we will not be able to stop Putin in Ukraine, he will go further.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: You live in Kyiv. You've posted some dramatic photos showing young children hovering by candlelight at night eating, trying to do schoolwork. Give us a sense of what it's like to be living in Kyiv right now under these Russian missile attacks.

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: It's rather cold. I have no heat in my flat. And we live in a world of total uncertainty. Like, OK, everything which we take for granted to name the normal life is very fragile.

When you have no light, you can't plan when you go to shop or when you go to postal office because you have no idea when your alarm started and all shops and postal office were closed. Or when the light were disappeared and suddenly you can't do Zoom with your partners to discuss some work and issues because you have no connections. So it's difficult, but we will endure this winter.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: The Russian strategy seems to be to use these attacks to break the will of the Ukrainian people to resist. Is there any chance that they could succeed in this?

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: The Russians failed in preparation. In this war, all Ukrainians know what for what we are fighting for. We are fighting for our freedom. We are fighting for our democratic choice. We are fighting for human dignity.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: Do the Russians have any support in Ukraine?

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: It's very hard to get support when Russians hit residential buildings, churches, schools, hospitals. Like we have a joke that Putin is one of the best consolidator of Ukrainian nation.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: You have called for a special international tribunal to try Vladimir Putin. How do you imagine putting him and his leadership on trial in an international tribunal, absent an invasion of Russia and toppling his government?

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: Our task is even much more ambitious. Because we speak not only about Putin and the rest of senior political leadership and high military command. We speak about all the Russians who committed this crimes by their own hands. And we speak not from the side of perpetrators. We don't need revenge. We need justice. I speak from the side of victims of this war.

And my goal is to provide chance for each person who suffered from war crimes for a fair trial and effective investigations regardless of who they are, what the type of crime they were endured, like whether or not media is interested in their cases. Yes, it's a question how to physically like arrest Vladimir Putin. But look to the history. There are a lot of successful and very convincing examples when people who see themselves untouchable suddenly appear under the court.

So, OK, there is nothing which be guaranteed. But we are not predicting future. We are fighting for to create the future which we want.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: A final message that you have for the American people? What do you want them to know about what's going on in your country right now?

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: I think two things. First, we are very grateful to American people for all the support which we received in these traumatic times. It's very essential. Ukrainians will always remember who help us to resist to this genocidal war, who help us to fight for freedom for democracy and for human dignity. It's first, which I want to emphasize.

And second, we need more support. This war has different dimensions. We will discuss the military, which I am not expert because we need military support. But also there are informational dimension of this war, economical dimension of this war, like and while you dimension of this war. And Putin, he tried to convince the whole world that democracy, freedom, rule of law, human rights are fake values because they couldn't protect you during the war.

Because the law doesn't work. But I do believe that it's temporary. And that's why we need support in our fight for justice. We must establish international tribunal and hold Putin, Lukashenko, and other Russian war criminals accountable.

MICHAEL ISIKOFF: Well, I know that a lot of our listeners and readers will be wishing you the best of luck and hope that Ukraine can preserve its independence and freedom. I want to thank you for spending the time.

OLEKSANDRA MATVIICHUK: Thank you.

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